Uncomfortable in the post "Doing the course digitally?"

2021-12-27 03:38

I too am strictly a digital artist - and despite this, I'm the one behind the recommendation.

Drawabox is not a course that tries to teach the use of any particular tools - so, regardless of whether one plans on working primarily with ink, or digital media, it doesn't change how this course is best used. We recommend the use of ink and paper because it aligns and reinforces the concepts we teach, and it makes them considerably more effective.

Of course, it is your choice at the end of the day, and you certainly don't deserve any hate for that choice. People get overzealous, and I apologize for that.

Uncomfortable in the post "First exercises done, something you can point out before keep going? I'll gladly hear you guys :)"

2021-12-27 03:33

This subreddit doesn't allow single exercises or partial work, as explained here. You can get feedback on individual exercises on the discord chat server though, and the folks there would be happy to help you out. For the subreddit, we're pushing students to post complete lesson work.

For what it's worth, your ellipses are coming along fine.

Uncomfortable in the post "I want to lern to paint like the old masters, do I need to know how to draw or would I benefit me to lern how to draw. No talent what so ever"

2021-12-24 16:50

Try asking this question over on /r/learnart. This subreddit is reserved specifically for those working through the lessons on drawabox.com, as explained here.

That said, Drawabox may be of use to you. It doesn't get into painting/colour/value/light and other somewhat more advanced concepts, but it does focus on the core fundamentals of drawing - specifically confident and controlled markmaking, and especially spatial reasoning (the ability to understand how the things you draw/paint exist in a three dimensional world, despite existing on a flat page or canvas).

For context, this student of mine started with Drawabox as his first step, before continuing onto other resources for learning how to paint. Currently, he works as one of my paid teaching assistants, and helps critiquing students' work. If you'd like to ask him questions about how he went about learning to paint, you can do so on our discord chat server, where he goes under the name "robsdeadnow". I believe he also teaches painting, mentoring others through Patreon.

I, uhh, assure you - he's still alive, despite his name.

Uncomfortable in the post "Started an online art class and this was one of the exercises."

2021-12-24 16:46

Try posting this over on /r/learnart or /r/learntodraw. This subreddit is reserved specifically for those working through the lessons on drawabox.com, as explained here. Drawabox focuses on the core fundamentals of drawing and does not get into more complex topics such as figure drawing and anatomy.

Uncomfortable in the post "Printer paper?"

2021-12-23 17:59

That would certainly be a-okay. It's a good way to keep your stuff organized, while still avoiding working in sketchbooks. I would probably recommend punching holes in them after you've finished your work though - and don't worry too much if the holes fall on top of your linework, as the benefit of those drawings comes from having produced them, rather than in their preservation after the fact.

Uncomfortable in the post "Geralt, graphite on paper by me, 2020"

2021-12-23 01:08

This subreddit is not one intended for sharing your work. It is reserved for those working through the lessons on drawabox.com, as explained here. Try posting this on /r/drawing, /r/art, or /r/idap instead, and be sure to read each community's rules on self-promotion before doing so.

Uncomfortable in the post "Help me understand Scott Robertson"

2021-12-23 01:07

Unfortunately, this subreddit is reserved for posts relating to the lessons on drawabox.com, as explained here. I'd recommend asking this over on /r/learnart or /r/learntodraw.

That said, one of our students-turned-teaching-assistants has written an article on H2D, how one could go about using it, and what one might use instead as a simpler alternative. You'll find it here.

Personally, I use the book as a reference rather than a lesson - it stays on my shelf until I need to figure out how to solve a very specific perspective problem, at which point I'll pull it out, flip to whatever section talks about my specific issue, then try to apply the techniques there.

This actual level of highly specific perspective isn't actually required for most things - rather, what one needs is a much lighter introduction to perspective, vanishing points, the convergences of parallel edges when drawn as lines in 2D, and a more generally developed sense for spatial reasoning (the manipulation of simple 3D forms in 3D space, on a much more organic level).

Uncomfortable in the post "Help me please"

2021-12-22 16:14

Your post doesn't actually explain what it is you specifically need help with. This subreddit is reserved for those working through the lessons on drawabox.com, which as explained here is a free course focused on learning the core fundamentals of drawing. That may be of use to you.

If not, try asking a more specific, targeted question over on /r/learnart or /r/learntodraw, detailing exactly what it is you need help with, and perhaps with examples of your attempts.

Uncomfortable in the post "Is lesson 2 dissection excercise done with or without shadows ?"

2021-12-21 19:05

One of the inevitable things that arises from a course being developed over many years is that some sections get updated, while others get a little left behind, until time can be scraped together to update them as well. Right now we're kind of stuck in that sort of a position, and while we're making considerable efforts to start updating all of the lesson content to eliminate inconsistencies, the texture section of Lesson 2 is probably one of the main areas that suffers from this.

To put it simply, the texture analysis content was produced much more recently, whereas the dissection material is a fair bit older. So, the texture analyses are somewhat more refined and better reflect the concepts we're looking for, stressing the importance of focusing on understanding the individual textural forms that are present on a surface, and thinking through what kind of shadows they would cast in order to imply them as part of our texture.

Long answer short, try to apply the principles from the texture analysis when working on the dissections. Focus on understanding the nature of each form, and try to determine what kind of shadow it would cast. Try to avoid outlining your textural forms, and avoid form shading as well.

Uncomfortable in the post "Where to find Art workshops/webinars?"

2021-12-21 19:01

This question is probably better suited to more general communities like /r/learnart - and for local workshops, you might ask around in the subreddit for your local community. This subreddit is reserved for those working through the lessons on drawabox.com, as explained here.

Uncomfortable in the post "should I do drawabox lessons both using a real pen and a tablet pen?"

2021-12-20 21:48

The thing to always keep in mind is that it's not that Drawabox is "meant for real pen", but rather that the use of the recommended tools (fineliners, printer paper, etc) are part of how the course is designed. Those recommendations are given because they go hand in hand with what's being taught, helping the overall course material, exercises, etc. to be more effective.

Drawabox is not a course that teaches people how to draw with pen, or with any specific medium - rather, it's a course that teaches people the core fundamentals of drawing, and uses ink/pen/paper as an important part of its strategy. So, doing it twice (once with pen and once digitally) would be kind of redundant.

I get that you want to get used to your tablet, and some of the exercises from Lesson 1 may well help with that, but you're also going to get used to it by just using it. You're certainly welcome to, and encouraged to, work digitally while adhering to the 50% rule (from Lesson 0), and that should be more than enough to help you get comfortable with drawing digitally, while building those core skills the way the course was intended to be done.

Remember that there is a considerable difference between learning how to draw, and learning how to use a specific tool. Doing Drawabox digitally to learn how to use your tablet is kind of like dropping a nuclear bomb on a nail to drive it through some wood.

Uncomfortable in the post "[Lesson 1] What should I even look out for when I draw the red lines in the rough perspective exercise?"

2021-12-20 19:41

Pay attention to the circumstances that yield your line extensions being especially far off the mark from your intended vanishing point. Often students will see that the further out to the left or right they are from the VP, the more dramatically they miss it. This would suggest that we need to assume a much sharper convergence as we get further out than we originally might expect.

Uncomfortable in the post "Bad idea to do draw a box using a vertical easel??"

2021-12-20 15:29

I would not recommend that.

The thing to keep in mind is that Drawabox is not a bunch of separate exercises, requirements, restrictions, etc. just slapped together for the hell of it. Nor is it specifically a course tailored towards learning how to draw with a specific tool. Every element that we recommend (in the case of those using community feedback) or require (in the case of those paying for official critique) serves a purpose. We work with fineliners because the rich, black marks we're forced to make with them help us develop a number of good habits, which other tools do not allow for. Working on loose paper on a desk (or drafting table for the fancier among us) allows us to focus on the core mechanics of making a single mark to the best of our ability, rather than spreading our efforts across learning to make every mark perfectly so early (of course this is something you can do on your own later, but which will distract you from what you're meant to be learning here).

Every student who tackles this course has their own long term goals, and they're all different - Drawabox is not concerned with what that might be. Drawabox is only concerned with teaching a very specific set of core, fundamental skills as effectively as it can.

There are many other courses that will make use of a drawing easel, or a donkey bench, and that will use a variety of other tools depending on what they're looking to teach. It's very common, for example, for figure drawing courses to have students drawing more vertically, and to use either charcoal or graphite - and these choices go hand in hand with the specifics of what those courses are teaching.

In the future, you will inevitably be in a better position to understand, and therefore alter, the way in which the courses you encounter now are to be tackled, but right now as a beginner, you are not equipped with what you need for that. Thus, it is best to follow each course at face value, adhering to all of their individual requirements and restrictions, so you can follow them as they were intended (unless otherwise stated by said course - some do encourage experimentation, and that is simply another part of how they opt to achieve specific goals).

Uncomfortable in the post "Lesson 1 Exercise 7:"

2021-12-18 20:36

This subreddit doesn't allow single exercises or partial work, as explained here. You can get feedback on individual exercises on the discord chat server though, and the folks there would be happy to help you out. For the subreddit, we're pushing students to post complete lesson work.

Uncomfortable in the post "I don't get lesson 7's airplane demo?! I'd draw the ortographic view on one side and then extend it but it isn't what happens in this step, I don't get how the front of the plane is made, I'm very confused. I know it's my fault and not the demo's, I'm having a hard time with this lesson."

2021-12-18 20:35

In retrospect, it wasn't a particularly great demonstration - the ones you'll find in the informal demos section have some value to offer (in this case it's mostly the analysis of the plane's profile in the first few steps), but as they're done as part of a student's critique, they address primarily whatever specific issues they were running into, and may have cut corners or mistakes in areas where I wasn't really paying attention.

In this case, for example, I actually messed up the alignment of the tip of the plane's nose. It should have been placed at the center of that front plane, as determined by the crossing diagonals (which I emphasize here in blue).

Instead, it'd probably make the most sense here to use an approach similar to the computer mouse demo from Lesson 6, where you lay out those orthographic slices in 3D space, as shown here, then expand from there.

It's also worth mentioning that this demonstration lacks the level of precision seen in other demos like the Shelby Mustang demo, both because my focus was on something specific to the student's submission, and because this demonstration was done years ago. This is something that will be resolved in the coming months, as I'm working on an effort to update the content and bring everything more in line, ensuring that concepts emphasized in certain demos are present across all of them, and largely to eliminate the inconsistency that has come from the course being developed over the course of many years.

Uncomfortable in the post "I can picture my dream home but why can't I draw it?"

2021-12-18 17:59

Yup, looks like you understood me just fine.

Uncomfortable in the post "Help with black panther disco ball"

2021-12-18 17:58

This subreddit is reserved for those working through the lessons on drawabox.com, as explained here. Normally I'd recommend a more suitable subreddit for an off-topic post, but in your case I'm not entirely sure.

What you can do however is head over to /r/crafts and check out their sidebar. It has a ton of more specific subreddits listed, which may help you find a community that is better suited to helping you out.

Uncomfortable in the post "I can picture my dream home but why can't I draw it?"

2021-12-17 22:56

The thing to keep in mind about the grid method, or generally focusing on "one corner" at a time is that you end up focusing much more on taking two dimensional information (for example, from a reference photo) and transferring it directly to a two dimensional piece of paper. What's skipped over is the extremely important step of understanding how those things actually exist in 3D space - to understand them beyond what is strictly visible, and to actually consider how they fit together in a three dimensional world. This is actually something we address in the drawabox course - in fact, it's what the whole course is built to teach. That is, the capacity to think about the things we draw as they exist in a 3D world.

So instead of worrying about all of the details that may be present, we focus on the major forms, building them out with understanding to how they relate to one another in 3D space. With those foundational "major" forms present, we can then start attaching smaller, more nuanced forms to them, gradually working our way from simple to complex for the entire construction, building it all out bit by bit.

This approach allows us to better understand not just how to replicate a specific image, but how to really understand the world - and thus gives us the tools we need to introduce new things (from our imagination).

The thing about drawing is that the lines and shapes we use are just tools - but they are not the end goal. The end goal is to take a concept from your mind, and to implant it into the mind of your audience. That concept describes something that exists three dimensionally, beyond the bounds of the flat shapes and marks that sit on the paper itself.

Uncomfortable in the post "I can picture my dream home but why can't I draw it?"

2021-12-17 21:19

You'd probably be better off asking this over on /r/learnart - this subreddit is specifically reserved for those working through the lessons on drawabox.com, as explained here.

That said, your quandry is one that I've heard often. I myself don't suffer from it, for the simple reason that I can't see anything in my "mind's eye" - a condition known as aphantasia. But there are a lot of people who are able to, at least to an extent, visualize what it is they wish to draw. While this seems like a considerable advantage, there are many ways in which it is not. Many of my students actually struggle because of it - because they can see the things they wish to draw, but that does not translate to the page.

The reasoning for this is simple, and you alluded to it yourself. We know what things look like. We know what houses look like, what cars look like - you probably know what a bicycle looks like, given that these are things we interact with, or have interacted with, a fair bit throughout our lives. But that only means that you know enough to identify those objects, an act which is quite different from being able to actually reproduce it on a page.

What you see in your mind is more akin to that - it's enough information for you to understand what it is you're "seeing", but only that. In truth, without having studied houses themselves, and the individual specific components of which they're composed, there are a ton of gaps that your brain simply ignores. The solution however is simple - study houses. Not just by looking at them, but by actually drawing them. This is the primary way in which we actually identify and fill in the gaps that lay between knowing enough about something to identify it, and knowing enough to actually reproduce it.

Having drawn and studied a ton of houses, your brain's "visual library" will be filled with enough individual architectural concepts that will help you better "describe" the house you hold in your head, to flesh it out and bring it a little closer to reality.

Ultimately while aphantasia left me with a lot of fears earlier on, making me worry that I didn't have the capacity to pursue art as a career, in a lot of ways it resulted in there being a much straighter path before me. After all, if I don't really know how what things look like - things I haven't studied, at least - then the obvious course of action for me would be to look at reference images of such objects, and to draw them so I can learn more about them, about what pieces they contain, and how they fit together.

This is something I demonstrate in this video I did for the Proko YouTube channel. In that video, I set out a task to iterate over different possible designs of griffins made up from pieces of a pigeon and a tiger. Before I do so however, I make a point of studying a bunch of different photos of pigeons and tigers, so I can better understand the tools with which I'm working.

So in your case, you might do the same. Draw a bunch of different houses, and buildings in general. Don't worry too much about what your dream house is specifically just yet, but rather familiarize yourself with all the pieces that can exist. And once you've done a sufficient amount of that exercise, you should find it to be somewhat easier to put that dream home to paper.

Uncomfortable in the post "Line confidence and stuff"

2021-12-17 21:03

It comes down to the fact that Drawabox is not teaching you technique - how you draw on your own work is entirely your business, and you are absolutely welcomed and encouraged to draw in whatever way you find comfortable.

When doing your own work.

Drawabox, however, is made up of exercises - things we do in order to develop specific skills, and to rewire the way in which our brain functions, and to change exactly what it is we find "comfortable". To build useful habits, as well as patience and discipline.

This in turn changes the way in which you draw on your own, and helps expand the kinds of marks we can make consistently and reliably. Chicken scratch itself speaks not only to the act of breaking a complicated mark down into multiple parts, but rather doing so erratically, without thought or specific intent. It speaks to the tendency to do so as a path of least resistance, to draw in that manner because we don't know how to make the mark in one go.

What we're doing here helps us develop that control, so we can ultimately decide based on what is better for our specific goal for a piece. We may still build up marks in segments (there are later exercises for this in Lesson 3, which help us to do so while having those segments flow smoothly and seamlessly together in a way that chicken scratching typically does not), but whether or not we do is subject to our own choices and decisions. Decisions made based on what is better for the resulting image, rather than our own limitations.

Uncomfortable in the post "NEW TO /r/ARTFUNDAMENTALS? Don't know what Drawabox is? Read this first."

2021-12-17 19:22

If you're drawing with your hand hovering over the page, you can allow it to rest gently against the page as explained here. That should allow for additional stability.

Uncomfortable in the post "Can I use different color ink for form intersection?"

2021-12-16 17:29

This is not something I would recommend, for the reason that it can cause students to feel that the intersections are some manner of separate, abstract analysis of the forms they've drawn, rather than an actual physical component of the resulting structure itself. The intersection lines aren't separate - they're actually the defined relationships between the different intersecting forms, kind of like the visible "weld lines" that occur when different pieces of metal are fused together with a torch. Their edges should be just as much a part of the original drawing as any others, so it's best to draw them with the same pen.

Uncomfortable in the post "searching for an app on playstore for drawing anime"

2021-12-15 22:35

You'd probably be better off asking this over on /r/learnart - posts here must either be drawabox homework submissions, or relate to the drawabox material, as explained here. Limiting the subreddit to that kind of content helps students get as many eyes on their work as they can, improving chances of getting helpful feedback.

Uncomfortable in the post "2D perspective eye level line/horizon line, need help.. there is no horizon line, where can I locate the eye level line. If someone can put the line, Ill be grateful a ton!!"

2021-12-15 22:33

This question is more suitable for /r/learnart, as this subreddit is reserved for those working through the lessons on drawabox.com, as explained here.

That said, here's the horizon line for that photograph. You can find it by first finding the vanishing points for that building, as I did in red, then finding the line that passes through those horizontal vanishing points (in blue). That blue line is the horizon line, upon which all your horizontal vanishing points will sit.

Uncomfortable in the post "Hi, sorry, I don't have anywhere else I can ask this."

2021-12-14 00:26

Here's the jist of how I would tackle that problem, using the concepts I shared previously. As with those, this is not 100% precise for reasons that will become clear.

Main things to keep in mind:

• We have the radius in 3D space of the circle we wish to draw. It corresponds to one of the edges of our box. I've chosen the depth, and am going to figure out the ellipse we need in order to rotate along the "width" as our rotational axis. This would of course also require us to repeat the same process, finding another ellipse, for the corresponding depth edge on the far side of the box.

• With that radius, we can find what would be "double" that distance in 3D space by using this technique from Lesson 6. The example there uses the technique to subdivide the plane at specific distances from either side, but we can use the same principle to duplicate a distance.

• We cannot trust that the height of the box is equal to the radius. They look similar on the page, but we have no actual reason to be able to trust that, so we must not. Therefore we have to transfer the distance of the diameter from one dimension (depth) to another (height), and in a sort of backwards fashion, doing so requires us to actually draw the ellipse we're trying to figure out in the first place. We use this technique in Lesson 7, specifically this video to create a 3D unit grid.

• This leads to the reason behind my lack of precision - I don't have enough information to draw the ellipse easily. I have the left and right vertical edges, and I know how the ellipse's minor axis needs to align, but if I draw the ellipse with different degrees, it'll impact the height of the plane that would enclose it.

• I know that the points at which the ellipse touches those top/bottom edges should align towards the vertical vanishing point.

• So, I draw an ellipse while trying to approximate where those contact points will fall. Without actually drawing those top/bottom edges, I can't actually see clearly where the contact points would be, but I can get rough idea. You could eke out more precision/accuracy if you had a couple rulers in addition to an ellipse guide to test it all out, or if you drew the edges in pencil, tested them with the ellipse, then erased them if they were wrong - but I've been working as an artist for a number of years and I have yet to come across a situation where that would be a worthwhile use of my time.

• The ellipse I approximated did end up being imperfect (the degree should have been narrower, resulting in a taller plane/ellipse), but it was still fairly close, with a pretty small margin of error. I wouldn't be against using that as the ellipse for my rotation, or the plane enclosing it as a representation of a square in 3D space.

Uncomfortable in the post "Hi, sorry, I don't have anywhere else I can ask this."

2021-12-13 20:19

While the question isn't exactly drawabox related, we do tackle similar concepts so I'm approving the post.

We explore the concept of testing whether our planes are squares in 3D space in the 250 cylinder challenge, as well as in Lesson 7, but basically there's two criteria that we can check to either prove or disprove that the plane you highlighted in blue actually represents a square in 3D space (and therefore the ellipse within it would represent a circle in 3D space). Both criteria focus on the ellipse itself.

First, the ellipse's minor axis must align to the vanishing point that governs lines perpendicular to the plane's surface. In this case, that would be the right vanishing point of the scene. If you're unsure of why that is, read through this explanation of the relationship between the minor axis and normal vector in the context of ellipses.

If the minor axis is not aligned in this manner, then we'd have to change its rotation on the page until it was. Then we'd check the next criterion.

The second point involves looking at the points at which the ellipse makes contact with the top and bottom edges of the plane itself. Identify these two points, then find the line that passes through them. This line, the "contact point line" should align to the vertical vanishing point, which in this case appears to be at infinity, making all vertical lines run straight up and down with no convergence.

If we test these two criteria against the ellipse you've drawn in that plane, as shown here, you'll see that neither fit. Both the minor axis line and the contact point lines are misaligned - but that doesn't mean the plane itself doesn't represent a square in 3D space. Since both are off, it might simply be that the ellipse was not drawn correctly. If on the other hand our minor axis were aligned correctly but the contact point line was still way off, then the plane would simply not represent a square.

So, if we correct the alignment of the ellipse and adjust its degree to still touch all 4 edges as shown here (I've got a load of critiques to tackle today, so I didn't have the time to line this up perfectly, but it was close enough), then we can see that this does actually bring the contact points more in line as well. There's still a bit of a margin of error there, but it's fairly small, and could be accounted for by the ellipse not touching all 4 edges perfectly.

Alternatively, the plane itself could still be slightly off, but I'd call this plenty close enough to work from, as these methodologies aren't really designed to produce perfect results. For that, we'd rely on everything going back to the vanishing points. The approach we employ in Drawabox, and that Scott Robertson speaks to in his book, is more about having a "correct enough" perspective to be able to build up your constructions organically without having to plot every little thing back to the vanishing points.

I hope that clarifies things a little.

Uncomfortable in the post "Please critique my work"

2021-12-12 15:52

This subreddit doesn't allow single exercises or partial work, as explained here. You can get feedback on individual exercises on the discord chat server though, and the folks there would be happy to help you out. For the subreddit, we're pushing students to post complete lesson work.

Uncomfortable in the post "When you want your drawings to actually look good, do you still draw the construction lines like spheres, cylinders etc or do you you just imagine them in your mind and draw without them so the drawing looks cleaner?"

2021-12-11 17:07

I'm assuming you're asking in the context of the Drawabox course (which this subreddit focuses on) - just adding this disclaimer because your wording leaves me uncertain as to whether your question is more general or not (since plenty of people ask questions here without realizing the community's focus).

The way Drawabox employs construction is as an exercise you can do, which involves solving a sort of 3D spatial puzzle. We start with simple forms, and add further simple forms to them, while defining their relationships in 3D space and ultimately working in the direction of the goal defined by our reference. This - the manipulation of 3D forms on the flat surface of the page we're drawing on, and of defining the spatial relationships between them - is what actively rewires our brains to perceive the things we draw as though they're 3D, not just lines and shapes on a flat page or canvas.

We can use construction when solving particularly difficult spatial problems in our own drawings, but the intent is that you'll continue to draw in whatever way you find most comfortable, when working on your own stuff outside of the exercises assigned by the course.

So, to answer your question:

• Construction is an exercise and a tool - outside of using it as an exercise, when drawing your own things, it's not the only approach one can employ. There's no one right approach - there are just a bunch of tools that you have in your belt, and you use whatever suits what you're doing at the time.

• The spatial reasoning skills the constructional drawing exercise develops is effectively what does allow us to hold that understanding in our minds, rather than needing to always drawing it explicitly. We draw it all explicitly for the purpose of the exercise, but outside of it as those skills develop, you'll find yourself being able to rely less and less upon them for your own pieces.

• That said, keeping things "cleaner" isn't necessarily a reason to forego construction altogether. It depends - if your goal is to perform for an audience, then there's something to be said about whipping out paint or a brush pen or whatever and just jumping into whatever you want to draw. That of course would require really well developed spatial reasoning skills, along with a healthy serving of confidence. If however your primary goal is to produce a drawing to the best of your ability, there are undoubtedly going to be other avenues you can take to still use construction, but remove it after the fact. Working digitally obviously makes that easy with the use of layers, but when working traditionally there are options as well - from using a pencil which can be erased to lay down your base structure, to using transfer paper, etc. Since I don't usually work traditionally in my own artwork, I don't know of all the options that are available, but it's not uncommon for artists to develop their work in stages, iterating over the same piece multiple times to nail it as well as they possibly can, making use of all the tools they have at their disposal. Just keep in mind that the goal isn't always to produce something as well as you can - there are many priorities one might put in front of the rest, from meeting a deadline, to impressing an audience with a live performance, and so on.

Uncomfortable in the post "250 boxes challenge ghosting and order"

2021-12-10 22:30

Ghosting your lines towards where that vanishing point will be is fine - though I don't want you to get in the habit of actually marking the vanishing point itself (since that would restrict you to drawing boxes whose VPs are always on the page, and there are many cases where they'd be much farther off). Anything else you want to mark off that would be consistently on the page is fine - for example, this approach demonstrated by ScyllaStew takes advantage of the points we define during the use of the ghosting method's planning phase to negotiate how to orient her lines, specifically by putting down points for multiple lines, before actually putting those lines down.

While I wouldn't say there's an optimal, step by step order for each of the lines, the lines for the intial Y should be defined first, then it's usually good to add a line to each set, one at a time, so they're all developed gradually rather than focusing too much on one set, then moving onto the next when it's done.

Uncomfortable in the post "Live online courses for Artists"

2021-12-10 19:22

I would recommend asking this over on /r/learnart - this subreddit is reserved for those working through the lessons on drawabox.com, as explained here.

That said, I do have a few answers for you:

• CG Master Academy is generally fairly well regarded, and has been around for a while now, and offer a range of classes.

• When the pandemic hit, a lot of smaller private schools that did offer in-person teaching pivoted temporarily to online teaching, and are still doing so. This includes schools like Concept Design Academy (I attended this school in person back in 2013/2014 and it was pivotal in my development) and Brainstorm School (started by a couple of instructors I had the pleasure of learning from at CDA).

• While this isn't a school, Peter Han currently offers his Dynamic Sketching course - he's taught this in schools like CDA and CGMA (again, I took it at CDA, and it was definitely the most significant drawing course I've taken to date), as well as doing so in the renowned Art Center College of Art and Design. It really is one of the best courses you can take, in my opinion, when it comes to exploring drawing specifically.

My suggests here are biased by my background, having in concept design and illustration - the courses these schools offer lean much more towards teaching technical skill, rather than what you'll find at a more fine-art oriented institution. Additionally, they are geared towards career building, but in that regard they still apply just as well to hobbyists in every way except the cost. These courses are not cheap.

Again, be sure to ask over on /r/learnart, as you should get other suggestions from people with different sets of experience than myself.

Uncomfortable in the post "how to stop Necker Cube illusion?"

2021-12-09 21:08

Generally we address that (at least in the box challenge itself, which I assume you've finished prior to tackling the more advanced box exercises) by filling one of the three faces that point towards the viewer with hatching. It provides the brain with a frame of reference to make sense of the box, despite being able to see all of its edges. Generally however, as you continue to do this, your brain should generally adapt to pay more attention to the information provided by the convergences of your lines towards their implied vanishing points - so your brain will essentially pick up on, "oh they're converging in this direction" and the faces that are closer to the viewer will become a bit more clear.

Uncomfortable in the post "Vanishing points"

2021-12-09 17:01

For the box challenge, we're largely drawing boxes that are rotated randomly in space. Since we only get vanishing points at infinity when the rotation of the box is "snapped" to certain alignments relative to the viewer (a vanishing point goes to infinity only when the set of lines it governs run perpendicular to the viewer's angle of sight), we can pretty much assume that the random rotations will never end up aligning so perfectly. So, always be sure to work with 3 concrete vanishing points, and to consciously focus on having those lines converge consistently to the best of your current ability.

Of course this is something that will be difficult, and you'll make plenty of mistakes - that's why we use the line extensions to analyze our work and identify those mistakes, so we can attempt to adjust our approach on the next page.

Uncomfortable in the post "Lesson 1"

2021-12-09 16:59

This subreddit doesn't allow single exercises or partial work, as explained here. You can get feedback on individual exercises on the discord chat server though, and the folks there would be happy to help you out. For the subreddit, we're pushing students to post complete lesson work.

So far your work is coming along well though, so keep up the good work.

Uncomfortable in the post "Consistent! Determined!"

2021-12-09 16:58

This subreddit doesn't allow single exercises or partial work, as explained here. You can get feedback on individual exercises on the discord chat server though, and the folks there would be happy to help you out. For the subreddit, we're pushing students to post complete lesson work.

That said, keep up the good work! Your ellipses in planes are looking solid. Might want to slow down a little on the table of ellipses though - they're pretty loose, and based on your work, I think you're capable of more control, if you apply the ghosting method's 3 steps (planning/preparation/execution) patiently to each ellipse.

Uncomfortable in the post "Is it mandatory to put vanishing points in the 250 box challenge?"

2021-12-08 21:02

No, the box challenge is quite the opposite - we do not plot our vanishing points, but rather try to focus on the behaviour of the lines themselves, inferring how a given set is converging and using the implication of their vanishing point to help orient the next line (rather than actually having far-off vanishing points marked out). Then we use the line extensions described in the challenge to test how consistently our lines are converging, so we can adjust our approach and retarget our attention as needed for the next page.

Uncomfortable in the post "drawabox assignment submission.. 2 yeras later"

2021-12-08 20:59

Keep in mind that as explained here, submissions on this subreddit must include all the work from a given lesson - partial work is not permitted, in the interest of avoiding clutter and helping people get as many eyes on their full homework posts. Students looking to get feedback mid-lesson are welcome to post their work on the discord chat server where each lesson has its own channel.

Also, it's probably best to submit individual images of each page, as this makes it easier to critique than a progress video like this. There is value in seeing the process, but it goes by so quickly that I imagine people will have difficulty with it.

Uncomfortable in the post "Confusion about Ellipse Guides and Wheels"

2021-12-07 22:56

While the limitation makes things a little awkward, you will find that it's not nearly as bad as it seems. You are far better off working with the ellipse guide, rather than freehanding them.

Uncomfortable in the post "LESSON 1 EXCERCISE 1-5 DONE - Would appreciate some feedback :-)"

2021-12-07 15:26

This subreddit doesn't allow single exercises or partial work, as explained here. You can get feedback on individual exercises on the discord chat server though, and the folks there would be happy to help you out. For the subreddit, we're pushing students to post complete lesson work.

For what it's worth, your work is coming along quite well thus far. There are no significant issues that jumped out at me, at a glance.

Uncomfortable in the post "What would be a good resource for drawing people?"

2021-12-07 07:00

Generally folks in our community use Proko or Brent Eviston. For what it's worth though, each course will have its own way of doing things - I appreciate that you're fond enough of Drawabox to want something similar, but try not to go into other resources with that expectation. Rather, when it comes to well regarded instructors, you're guaranteed to walk away with something of value - more than anything, it's a matter of picking one and committing to it.

All that said, try asking this over on /r/learnart though, for a more varied response. Since this question technically isn't related to Drawabox, I can't approve it to have others here weigh in.

Uncomfortable in the post "Are the marks on the ellipse template the only possible minor axis? Explain question in the comments"

2021-12-06 18:09

Huh, interesting. Thanks for letting me know!

Uncomfortable in the post "NEW TO /r/ARTFUNDAMENTALS? Don't know what Drawabox is? Read this first."

2021-12-06 18:07

If you're struggling with balancing several things at once, then your first priority should be to ensure that you're giving one thing as much time as it requires. Eventually you should feel more comfortable with adding more to your plate, but there is no good reason to pile your plate high so early.

Remember most of all - people have a tendency of prioritizing what they "want" to learn, and while one's desires will determine the direction they take, it's very easily to focus too much on what it is you want long-term. Each overarching goal will have many things you may not be all that interested in doing - that is precisely where one is liable to spend far too little time, especially if they're too preoccupied with what they'd like to learn at that moment.

Circling back - if you're not comfortable with taking on many things at once, don't.

Uncomfortable in the post "Left handed question"

2021-12-06 18:02

The direction in which you draw is based on what you yourself feel most comfortable - so if you find drawing from left to right, even doing so left handed, to be comfortable and natural to you, then that's fine.

Uncomfortable in the post "Can I place the vanishing points in the page in some lesson 7 drawings?"

2021-12-06 18:01

Mistakes will happen. These drawings are, all of them, just exercises, so if we're going to make mistakes at any point, now is certainly the time. Part of the course as a whole is meant to help students separate themselves from reliance on explicit the vanishing points (which can often be placed way off the page), but rather to continuously infer the VP's position based on the lines that are actually present on the page itself. Meaning, each time we would otherwise check the position of the vanishing point, instead we look at how the lines that converge towards that VP are converging in order to add another line that matches to the set.

This is obviously more demanding, but the main thing is that it requires more time/consideration as we execute each mark. Given that Lesson 7 does allow you to use a ruler, however, we certainly can use the ruler to help us make those judgments, whereas freehanding is considerably more difficult.

Uncomfortable in the post "Sketchbook for graffiti"

2021-12-06 17:55

Try asking this over on /r/learnart. This subreddit is reserved for those working through the lessons on drawabox.com, as explained here.

Uncomfortable in the post "Are the marks on the ellipse template the only possible minor axis? Explain question in the comments"

2021-12-05 18:00

Unfortunately I'm running short on time and have a ton of things to do, so the best I was able to do was throw together this diagram of how one might go about constructing what is in effect a cylinder, such that it aligns to a particular minor axis line.

The important part is really at step 3, where we're drawing our first ellipse such that it:

1. Due to its orientation, aligns to the given minor axis line

2. Due to its degree, touches those top/bottom edges at "contact points" which align towards the vertical vanishing point. Since we're drawing our vehicles with a vertical vanishing point at infinity, that means the contact points sitting directly above/below one another, so a perfectly vertical line would pass through them.

If this diagram doesn't clarify things for you, I'd recommend asking for more support over on the drawabox discord chat server.

Uncomfortable in the post "NEW TO /r/ARTFUNDAMENTALS? Don't know what Drawabox is? Read this first."

2021-12-05 16:42

It's certainly possible. As long as you're adhering to all the rules of whichever courses you choose to follow, then balancing two simultaneously is not a problem. Do however keep in mind that there are things that Drawabox will teach you that will help the figure drawing material make more sense. That doesn't mean you shouldn't do figure drawing until you're done Drawabox - just that you will need to be patient with yourself, accepting that especially towards the beginning, not everything you learn about figure drawing will make sense, or will be something you can apply as directly as you would like.

Uncomfortable in the post "Are the marks on the ellipse template the only possible minor axis? Explain question in the comments"

2021-12-05 16:41

There are two distinct elements to an ellipse - its orientation (which determines its minor axis, or you can look at it the opposite way and say the minor axis you want to align to determines the orientation), and the degree. In a case like this, you have your minor axis predetermined, and so there's only the degree left to play with. Of course, as you change the degree, then the plane that encloses the ellipse would also change.

This is because not all ellipses you add to a scene will actually represent a circle in 3D space, and not all planes you draw will represent a square in 3D space. Once you have some other elements down on the page, then there's enough information that helps define the scene itself, and the viewer's relationship to it, that you can no longer take an arbitrary ellipse and say "this is a circle in a particular orientation in the world".

That is largely what the cylinders-in-boxes section of the cylinder challenge focuses on. That is, we draw a bunch of boxes, and use the cylinder (or rather its 2 ellipses) to check if the ellipses' line extensions align with the box's line extensions. If they do, then that tells us that the ellipses are indeed representing circles that rest on the surface of the box, and that our estimated proportions for the box are in fact square in those two opposite planes which contain the ellipses.

More often, however, they won't align so perfectly, and instead we'll be able to see that our estimations were off, and therefore some adjustment should be done in the next page of attempts. Gradually doing this over and over is intended to sharpen your instincts, allowing you to pick more correct proportions for your boxes/planes, regardless of how they're oriented in the world.

Uncomfortable in the post "Are the marks on the ellipse template the only possible minor axis? Explain question in the comments"

2021-12-05 15:33

You're missing one important property - it's the line that cuts the ellipse into two equal, symmetrical halves down its narrowest span. There is only one line for each ellipse that would qualify.

Your ellipse guide has a pair of markings for the major axis, a pair of markings for the minor axis, then one marking between them - not sure what it's for. But the one you want to pay attention to is the pair that crosses the ellipse's narrowest dimension. Basically where it's skinniest. On that photo, it's the markings on the left/right if each ellipse, rather than the ones on the top/bottom.

Uncomfortable in the post "NEW TO /r/ARTFUNDAMENTALS? Don't know what Drawabox is? Read this first."

2021-12-04 20:10

Ultimately whether or not one draws a mark confidently is entirely based on the choices we make in our approach - meaning, we actively choose whether or not we draw confidently.

So why would we ever choose not to draw confidently? The biggest reason is the fear of losing accuracy, and missing your intended mark. As a result of worrying about whether or not your mark's going to fall where you want it to, students will hesitate, slow down, ultimately attempting to steer the mark as they draw, which results in wobbling.

In this course, we employ the ghosting method - that is, a process that requires us to break our markmaking into three distinct phases, first planning (identifying the specific nature of the mark we wish to make, what its purpose is meant to be, and how it ought to be drawn to best achieve that goal), then preparation (repeating the desired drawing motion to push it down from our conscious brain into our subconscious and muscle memory), and finally executing with the conscious decision to do so with confidence, free from hesitation, and ultimately just committing to the stroke you've practiced.

This is time consuming, but it is an approach that students are expected to use for all their freehanded lines throughout the course. Doing so builds up good habits, training them to think before they draw, and to break the process up into separate stages instead of trying to do everything all at once.

While investing your time into the planning and preparation phases will improve your accuracy, at the end of the day you will likely still make mistakes (especially at first) if you're committing to executing your marks confidently in that last step. That's fine - mistakes will happen, but with practice they'll diminish, and your accuracy will improve. What matters most, however, is that your marks are made confidently, resulting in smooth and consistent trajectories, and that is something that is within your control right now.

You simply have to choose to prioritize that confidence over your accuracy, which due to our natural predisposition to being terrified of inaccuracy, is easier said than done.

Uncomfortable in the post "NEW TO /r/ARTFUNDAMENTALS? Don't know what Drawabox is? Read this first."

2021-12-03 22:00

Make sure you're engaging your whole arm from the shoulder, and that you're using the ghosting method (that is, investing your time in the planning and preparation phases so you know the specific nature of the mark you want to draw, then executing with a confident stroke free from hesitation).

Sadly this course isn't really a place with much in the way of tips and tricks - there's the exercises as they're described, and then there's a whole lot of practice. But, of course, you can always share your current work on the discord server to see if other community members have anything else to offer.