250 Cylinder Challenge

9:31 AM, Sunday December 19th 2021

250 cylinders (1-150 No boxes) - Album on Imgur

Direct Link: https://i.imgur.com/MobXLqd.jpg

Find, rate and share the best memes and images. Discover the magic of th...

Just in case the links bug

https://imgur.com/a/MobXLqd

https://imgur.com/a/Oidpf4R

Here they are. Life got in the way more than once, but they're done, bad habits, warts 'n all. Nothing to say this time really.

0 users agree
3:53 AM, Tuesday December 21st 2021

Starting with your cylinders around arbitrary minor axes, there are a number of things you're doing fairly well here:

  • Your side edges are executed cleanly, using the ghosting method to achieve confident strokes with a fair bit of accuracy.

  • You're fairly fastidious in checking the alignment of your ellipses in red.

Additionally, you were executing your ellipses quite well early on - doing so confidently, keeping the ellipses evenly shaped, etc. - but this did take something of a turn for the worse starting with this page. Your execution became more hesitant and wobbly, suggesting perhaps a less consistent use of the ghosting method, and perhaps an inclination away from using your whole arm from the shoulder. It appears that this was after a pretty significant break, and it did improve again after several pages of struggling.

I can only assume that in these gaps, you're probably not keeping up with your warmups. These warmups, we're meant to be doing for 10-15 minutes every day, or every few days, or at least with some regularity, are where we continue to practice the exercises we've been introduced to throughout the course (picking 2 or 3 different ones each time) so we can continue to sharpen our skills and avoid having them get rusty. While ellipses may seem simple, they're really not (to the point that for Lessons 6 and 7, we allow and encourage students to use ellipse guides to avoid being distracted from the core of those specific lessons). Even those students who stick faithfully to their warmups, following all of the instructions for the course, are expected to still have difficulty with them (to the point of us choosing to eliminate that problem from those later lessons).

Continuing on, it appears you may have missed an important instruction for this part of the challenge. I can understand how that might happen if one is spreading the work across a long and somewhat inconsistent period of many months, and it certainly emphasizes the importance of going back over the instructions after every break (or even skimming them at the beginning of each sitting) to ensure that you are doing what was asked.

In the assignment section for the challenge, which you'll find screenshotted here, students are asked (in bold) to vary the rate of foreshortening across their cylinders throughout the set. That is something you did not do.

What you do appear to have done instead, is to artificially eliminate foreshortening from all of these cylinders, forcing those side edges to run roughly parallel to one another on the page, and placing their shared vanishing point at infinity. This concept of vanishing points at infinity was discussed back in Lesson 1. It is essentially what happens when we have 1 or 2 point perspective - we still have 3 vanishing points, but some of those exist at "infinity", so the lines they govern, despite "converging" towards this point that is infinitely far away, never actually get any closer or farther away from one another.

This, unfortunately, is not something we control. What we do control is the orientation of the cylinders, and it's that orientation that determines where the vanishing point will be. More specifically, a vanishing point will only ever "go to infinity" in the specific case that the lines they govern run perpendicular to the viewer's angle of sight, not slanting towards or away from the viewer at all. Given that this challenge has us drawing cylinders that, similarly to the boxes in the box challenge, are freely rotated, we can pretty much assume that the alignment would never be so perfect as to result in a vanishing point at infinity.

Furthermore, were we to look at actual boxes (like the boxes in the other section of this challenge), even if we did align a box so perfectly that two of its vanishing points were to sit at infinity, that would place the third vanishing point squarely on the page, with its lines converging quite dramatically and rapidly towards it. In perspective projection, we cannot have all three vanishing points of a rectilinear box at infinity. This is something we see in orthographic/axonometric/isometric projection, but those are distinctly separate from "perspective projection", which is an approach for representing 3D space on a flat surface in a way that replicates human binocular vision. Those other approaches, rather than putting all vanishing points at infinity, simply do not have actual vanishing points at all.

Now, it does seem that for a while in your cylinders in boxes (up to about halfway through) you did just that, putting all your vanishing points at infinity and artificially trying to keep everything parallel on the page. After that point, it was somewhat mixed - you were definitely converging some sets of lines towards concrete vanishing points, but there was often at least one set that would still attempt to stay parallel on the page.

Another point that stood out to me quite a bit is that you don't appear to have been checking your ellipses' minor axes correctly here. I grabbed a couple of pages in the middle of your set and identified the true minor axis on it. As you can see there, on each page, only one ellipse's minor axis was fairly close to the line you'd marked out for it - all of the others were wildly off.

The issue here is not the fact that your ellipse was misaligned. That's expected. The issue is that in not identifying the cases where that minor axis was off, you left yourself with no way of knowing what you were doing was incorrect, and thus no way of adjusting your approach. This analysis - like the line extension analysis from the box challenge - speaks to the core purpose of this part of the challenge, and so when we do it incorrectly, we undermine the effectiveness of the exercise.

This exercise is really all about helping develop students' understanding of how to construct boxes which feature two opposite faces which are proportionally square, regardless of how the form is oriented in space. We do this not by memorizing every possible configuration, but rather by continuing to develop your subconscious understanding of space through repetition, and through analysis (by way of the line extensions).

Where the box challenge's line extensions helped to develop a stronger sense of how to achieve more consistent convergences in our lines, here we add three more lines for each ellipse: the minor axis, and the two contact point lines. In checking how far off these are from converging towards the box's own vanishing points, we can see how far off we were from having the ellipse represent a circle in 3D space, and in turn how far off we were from having the plane that encloses it from representing a square.

Unfortunately, this means that with the actual minor axis being incorrectly identified, as well as the earlier issue of all of your lines being parallel on the page, you weren't able to apply the exercise towards its intended purpose.

Now, in such a situation, I would normally ask the student to do a full redo of the challenge, from start to finish, and in your case that is certainly warranted. I have had at least a few students who've stumbled into similar mistakes, and while they were by no means happy to have to redo the challenge as a whole, they did complete the task. Not only did they complete it, but they did so with such keen attention to every single mark they put down, and every single instruction. Not just in this challenge, but in the lessons that followed.

In your case, however, I am not going to assign a full redo. Instead, I will ask for half. That in itself is no easy task, nor should it be - reading and following the instructions is critical towards ensuring that your time (and my own) is not wasted. You'll be able to submit these revisions as a reply to this critique, without spending any additional critiques - but do be sure to give yourself the time to go through the instructions as carefully as you can. And of course, do not forget to do your warmups.

Next Steps:

Please submit the following:

  • 75 cylinders around arbitrary minor axes.

  • 50 cylinders in boxes.

When finished, reply to this critique with your revisions.
9:01 AM, Friday December 31st 2021

Links: (75 unboxed) https://imgur.com/a/ZcDax3b

(50 boxed): https://imgur.com/a/55hmDaC

TL:DR: Bad habits, lack of due diligence, lack of practice, and not throughly reading instructions.

Starting off, thank you very, very much for not assigning a full re-do. I appreciate that break greatly. I don't intend to make any excuses, but I do feel obliged to explain a few bits (though I doubt it's anything new). Just bad habits and a lack of due diligence.

For one, I still have a bad habit of seemingly regular hiatuses with little practice. I'll hit a point where I'll go "eh, do it tomorrow" and that turns into months. Not a new problem so I'll leave it there. But I do appreciate your reiterating of good warmup routine and I'm kinda glad (?) to know that elipses are a hurdle to the end of the course. It make me feel less...bleh about mine.

Continuing to the main error in this one, I truly don't know how I misunderstood the varrying of foreshortening part. I either missed it or (more likely) forgot early on. I wont deny that when I did go back, I skimmed the instructions each time. For some reason, I thought "They all gotta be the same size." Not an excuse, just...dunno, that's probably how it happened. I will be VERY sure to read ALL the instructions carefully next time. (Really hope I didn't miss something this time)

I, on this section still, appreciate you taking the time to explain "Why" we can't have the edges of the cylinders going to "infinity," why it just doesn't work, at least for the kind of things we're drawing, using perspective.

This leads in to my boxed cylinders. For my paralleled boxes, there's no valid excuse even, Just a bad habit from the start, relying on parallels over actually visualizing some kind of approximate vanishing point. I'm betting (because it's been quite a while) that my starting boxes were like that to get a feel for the challenge before picking VP's, but I know I probably shouldn't do that. Bad habit :(

As for the second part, my VERY misaligned minor axes, the reasoning is actually pretty simple. Instead of finding the minor axis, I looked for symmetry. If the line looked WAY off, like many of them very much were, I would go "nah, I must be looking at it wrong, it CAN'T be that off " and would look for where the elipse gets "cut in half" somewhat evenly. I hadn't even bothered to consider the major axis.

I'm very much hoping I fixed my errors with this resubmission, though I feel that some of my minor axes in the boxed cylinders might still be off by a bit. For more than a few identifying the major axis,and subsequently perpendicular minor axis to actually mark was difficult, but that may be due to their wonky shape more than anything. Either way I hope these are more accurate to what was asked of us in this challenge. I know the instructions say that we improve gradually, that errors are common but damn...still looks bad.

And not that I want to take any more of your time than I already have but I have some questions again.

I feel that, as I have in a few exercises before, even when I can identify what I did wrong,like with minor axes here, or box extensions and such in previous things, I don't quite know how to actually use the information this all reveals. I don't quite know how to take what I see to "fix" future work, or at least I'm not sure I do. With the planar elipses here, at best, I could go "Ok, so the contact point and axis were kinda off so I should angle them more like this, so they touch around here and the axis goes about there."

I just don't know if we're supposed to glean more than that. I know it's supposed to be gradual but...I dunno, it's hard to know if you're "learning" correctly.

I think that's actually all this time. I was going to ask about "proportionally square" faces but upon rereading a few times I think I understand that part. I think I just made my box faces a bit "rectangular" and got a little confused. I'm sure my whacked out boxes didn't help, but I think I understand what we're supposed to be retaining/learning.

Alright, I've rambled and edited and rewritten plenty I think.

Once again, thank you very much for not assigning a full redo, and thank you again for you time, teaching, critique, and patience. (I'm sorry btw,I know I'm overly formal/long winded with replies and such, can't really help it)

Thanks again, and Have a happy new year.

10:54 PM, Friday December 31st 2021

Well, I'll counter your novel with one that's equally brief. I think I made the right call in being lenient, as it appears it was enough to get you on the right track. As it stands, your cylinders are much better in both sections, though I do quickly want to call out an issue with your cylinders around minor axes - one that I specifically flush out of the bushes by demanding variation in the rate of foreshortening, allowing me to explain the concept in my critiques.

Foreshortening manifests in two changes or "shifts" between the ellipse closer to the viewer, and the one farther away. There's the shift in scale, which happens as a simple matter of course, given the convergence of the side edges squeezing it down. Then there's the shift in degree, which we discuss here as well as in the ellipses section from Lesson 1.

These two shifts, both being signals to the viewer that there's more foreshortening being applied, and therefore more of the cylinder's length exists in the "unseen" dimension of depth, need to operate in tandem. This means that you should not see a dramatic shift on one, and a shallower shift on the other. They should be occurring at roughly the same rate.

So, be sure to keep that in mind as you move forwards.

As to your question, unfortunately you really do have the whole of it down. These analysis do not teach us how to do better - that's really the realm of "tips" and "tricks" - quick solutions of which there are few out there when it comes to the core fundamentals of drawing. Rather, in identifying them, we're identifying things that we may not be investing as much time on in how we approach things.

So, in the context of the box challenge for example, the line extensions tell us we may not be thinking actively enough about all 4 lines simultaneously while we draw any one of them. We may focus more on just a pair, or three out of four.

That said, knowing the issue's there isn't going to be enough to resolve it outright. Knowing is, as they say, half the battle. The rest is practice, while always trying to focus on all of the elements at play.

So! I'll go ahead and mark this challenge as complete. Keep up the good work, and have a happy new year.

Next Steps:

Move onto lesson 6.

This critique marks this lesson as complete.
The recommendation below is an advertisement. Most of the links here are part of Amazon's affiliate program (unless otherwise stated), which helps support this website. It's also more than that - it's a hand-picked recommendation of something I've used myself. If you're interested, here is a full list.
Ellipse Master Template

Ellipse Master Template

This recommendation is really just for those of you who've reached lesson 6 and onwards.

I haven't found the actual brand you buy to matter much, so you may want to shop around. This one is a "master" template, which will give you a broad range of ellipse degrees and sizes (this one ranges between 0.25 inches and 1.5 inches), and is a good place to start. You may end up finding that this range limits the kinds of ellipses you draw, forcing you to work within those bounds, but it may still be worth it as full sets of ellipse guides can run you quite a bit more, simply due to the sizes and degrees that need to be covered.

No matter which brand of ellipse guide you decide to pick up, make sure they have little markings for the minor axes.

This website uses cookies. You can read more about what we do with them, read our privacy policy.