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I'm having a few issues with understanding the lesson 1 conecpts

11:49 AM, Saturday December 19th 2020

Hello there, the name's Andounuts. I'm an aspiring hobbist artist who has started DrawABox with the intent of learning a soild core set of skills so I can do something more impressive than stick figures.

As it stands, I've completed lesson 0 and I'm currently soldiering my way through lesson 1. I've done the super imposed lines and the ghosted lines, but I'm having a bit of a pickle when it comes to the ghosted planes as you can see here: https://imgur.com/a/O2PcAVK

I'm not perfectly certain what problem I might be experiencing, but I think it has to do with the whole needing to rotate the page to a comfortable position thing. No matter how I turn the page I just cannot find an angle of attack where I can make the best use of my shoulder pivot and as such my lines suffer.

Another issue I'm having is to do with confidence and getting a smooth motion to my lines. Initially I was quite confident with with my lines, they were quite straight, but I was confident to the point that I kept overshooting my mark. By a significant margin. So then someone suggested that I slow down, but that caused my lines to ossicate like crazy. My planes don't even look like they were drawn by the same person in the same circumstances.

So yeah, that's what's going wrong with me right now. Any suggestions for improvement?

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1:04 PM, Saturday December 19th 2020
edited at 1:04 PM, Dec 19th 2020

Hello Andounuts and welcome to DaB!

First things first: if you haven't done alreay, I strongly suggest you join the Discord server. You'll find dedicated channels for every lesson (and much more) and many amazing people that can help you. That is also the right please to ask advice about partial exercises before submission.

You said that initially your lines were quite smooth and confident: that should be your goal. Confidence is the top priority when it comes to mark making, while accuracy follows with time and practice.

The problem with wobbly lines that I can see could be fixed by a great degree applying all the steps of the ghosting method. Read again all the pages of the Lesson 1 about markmaking, multiple times If you need to.

If you slow down too much, you give time to your brain to interfere during the execution, correcting the trajectory. Let your muscle memory do the work, always drawing from the shoulder with the canvas rotated in the most comfortable position for you shoulder joint.

edited at 1:04 PM, Dec 19th 2020
3:39 PM, Saturday December 19th 2020

Hi Liska.

First things first: if you haven't done alreay, I strongly suggest you join the Discord server. You'll find dedicated channels for every lesson (and much more) and many amazing people that can help you. That is also the right please to ask advice about partial exercises before submission.

Firstly, I am already a member of the offical discord server. I come here merely seeking addtional help to compliment the amount I'm already getting. Besides, I'm far more partial to tradtional froums like this. I can write as much as I like and no-one will bat an eye-lid and conversations I have here are traditionally more intelectual.

The problem with wobbly lines that I can see could be fixed by a great degree applying all the steps of the ghosting method. Read again all the pages of the Lesson 1 about markmaking, multiple times If you need to.

Secondly, I'm pretty sure I'm following the steps for ghosting correctly. When going through an exicise I first listen to Victor's reading of the aticle (I find that multi-sensory learning works the best) and then watch uncomfortable's accompanying video. But even then I go through the exicise and get this feeling in the back of my mind that I'm doing it wrong. It might help if there was a live demonstration of the technique that I could watch to be certain...

If you slow down too much, you give time to your brain to interfere during the execution, correcting the trajectory.

But if I speed up, then my mark will go straight through the intended point and keep going off the end of the page. Hmm... what a conumdrum...

always drawing from the shoulder with the canvas rotated in the most comfortable position for you shoulder joint.

Well that's the million pound question; where is this mystical "most comfortable position for my shoulder joint"? My page is going round and round like a spindashing sonic character and I still can't find it.

4:21 PM, Saturday December 19th 2020
edited at 4:23 PM, Dec 19th 2020

Sometimes I can't communicate with the right tone, I didn't mean to be rude or harsh by any means, therefore I apologize.

Now back to the topic. You can watch ShyllaStew videos, she went through Lesson 1, 2 and the 250 Box Challenge so far. It's a great way to check the practice live.

It's okay if your lines overshoot the end point at this stage, as long as those are confident smooth lines. You can try picking up the pen as it reaches the end point. A TA gave me the same advice because I was leaving a little tail in my ellipses and it worked after some practice.

Try to move your arm over the desk, blocking the wrist and the elbow. Can you find an angle that feels more natural than the others? That should be the most comfortable position for your shoulder.

edited at 4:23 PM, Dec 19th 2020
6:00 PM, Saturday December 19th 2020

What gave the impression that I though you were being rude? You've been rather polite to me so far.

Addtionally, I keep finding a fair amount of places where it feels right to draw from the elbow, but the shoulder (which I'm faily certain I should be using in this cicumstance) seems to move my arm in such a way that I'm not as sure as to how to angle the page and make my mark to use it.

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7:16 PM, Saturday December 19th 2020
edited at 7:21 PM, Dec 19th 2020

I'm afraid your lines aren't close to straight enough to pass a formal inspection. They are just too loose. It may sound harsh but it only gets more difficult from here and without getting this stuff solid you won't improve and the rest will be too difficult.

This was my initial submission for official assessment. I am a lot better now but I'm guessing this is the sort of standard you should be aiming for when starting out.

https://imgur.com/gallery/f2m3UqH

Now. How to get better.

Drawing from the shoulder doesn't mean it's only your shoulder that moves. It really means that your whole arm should be able to float and draw freely without relying on anchoring. This is difficult for someone who hasn't trained. You need to build up the strength and control of your muscles over time. I suspect this is a large part of where you have a problem, your muscles aren't developed yet for doing this. It takes a lot of time with deliberate and regular practice.

There are many youtube videos on this. These are the exercises that I do before each drawing session.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjLC4W4HHw4

I find that for drawing straight lines I find it easiest at a kind of 45 degree angle away from me. I think this is fairly common.

Drawing confidently is a balance of accuracy, speed and control. If you are over shooting it probably means you are going too fast for your current ability, so slow down and focus on hitting the destination spot. If you have the accuracy but not the speed focus on speed for a bit. You need to always isolate the problem and then focus on practicing that for a bit. This will then fold back into your regular practice.

It's not easy. It's hard work. It takes time and patience. Good luck.

PS Start with fairly short lines and build up your confidence with them. The longer the line, the more difficult it becomes.

edited at 7:21 PM, Dec 19th 2020
10:18 AM, Monday December 28th 2020

Hullo scoobyclub!

I went ahead and drew along with the video you reccomended, and here's what I got: https://imgur.com/a/XD51sec

Not bad for a first try?

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6:39 AM, Sunday December 20th 2020

heyo! welcome to drawabox dude!

I'd totally recommend warming up your arms first by doing some stretches so that you can feel more relaxed and comfortable before you start, then you should totally find your comfort zone when drawing by practicing various angles in different positions and see which one is best for you. Then you should practice making strokes at a good pace, not too fast but not too slow. as you dont want to wobble. Feel free to watch scyllastew, (probably spelled it wrong), and see how you can apply her techniques to your own.

Also, dont worry about overshooting your mark, it's totally ok dude. Just remember to pace yourself, warm up and stretch beforee starting and you'll totally do good dude. Hope you find this helpful and have a nice day dude!

12:09 PM, Sunday December 27th 2020

Same to you, doodlesofdishonour!

So when talking about stretches, what kind fo you recommend?

5:26 AM, Monday December 28th 2020

I totally recommend like basic stretches like stretching your arms across your chest, stretching your wrist by having the palm face up and gently pulling down by the fingers to get the wrist, lower arm and fingers warmed up, and sometimes a shoulder stretch as well cuz drawing from the shoulder can leave you sore sometimes. hope this helps, and feel free to look up any arm stretches that could totally help out dude!

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12:28 AM, Tuesday December 22nd 2020

I would recommend focusing on using your arm and shoulder. At first, you will only produce wobbly lines--this is normal. Just focusing on gaining control of your arm, and then you can create lines with precision.

Also experiement with table height and direction of stroke. For me, I have the desk almost at the level of my navel. Before I was sitting too low, and fatigued my arm faster. Now my arm can just hang, and move across the page. For stroke, what works best for me is either streight up-down towards me, or upper right corner to lower left (I'm right-handed). At an angle is more common, but as I'm taking shodo lessons, I'm also learning how to make strokes both vertical and horizontal.

Hope this helps. :)

11:58 AM, Sunday December 27th 2020

Why hullo Xenops!

Also experiement with table height and direction of stroke. For me, I have the desk almost at the level of my navel. Before I was sitting too low, and fatigued my arm faster. Now my arm can just hang, and move across the page.

Interesting suggestion, albiet it one I cannot experiment with at this. My desk has a fixed height and I sit in a wooden chair I cannot adjust. I am however, going to be moving out soon, so I'll put a low desk (if such a thing even exists under that name.) on my shopping list of furniture.

At an angle is more common, but as I'm taking shodo lessons, I'm also learning how to make strokes both vertical and horizontal.

I don't know what the word "shodo" means, can you please define it?

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