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3:15 AM, Tuesday August 16th 2022
edited at 6:42 AM, Aug 16th 2022

https://imgur.com/a/AOZYKTJ

I think I get it.

Still wonkie, but it finally clicked. I think that overshooting could take years to master, and even then, you'd never get it completely perfect. (Those tails are infuriating to see. It's going to drive me nuts in the future. Something I'll definitely have to practice with.)

I probably went a bit overboard. I just wasn't getting the overshoot. The video said don't overshoot too much, or too little. But what was too much, or too little. After reading what you wrote in my critique for the umpteenth time. Out loud to myself so I wasn't missing anything. I finally saw it. "Overshoot halfway between eclipses". (And I just noticed that in bold in the written material too. I guess no matter how many times you might read something, you'll always miss a vital piece of information when there is so much of it to take in.)

First page was a warm up, second page was going to be my submission, alas I still wasn't getting it right. Re-read, re-watch everything. Then three - eureka! (I don't normally do page after page of the same drawing. At least not unless I don't quite understand, otherwise it's one or two of something as a warm up, or while doodling.)

I'm also having trouble getting all the eclipses the same width. I guess that will come with practice. (And for some reason I thought it was July, that's neither here, or there.)

Thanks again.

Have a wonderful day!

--

4.31pm 16 Aug 22.

https://imgur.com/a/vzMBXIL

While you didn't ask for this, I thought I'd draw it anyway. And it gives me another plant practice. The same strawberry plant a week later, with a photo at a slightly different angle.

The first drawing turned out wrong, so I didn't finish it. It remained a "sketch". It was also an overhead angle, so the foreshortening of the plant I didn't quite grasp.

I wasn't sure about the leaves, I'm still not sure. Do we do these kind of leaves like a complete flower? Or do we do the leaves separately? In some case I can see doing them like we did the hibiscus, while in others they appear to three separate entities. (A humble strawberry plant through me for a loop.)

How does one do these small stems? If it was a drawing/study of one single leaf, I can see using the eclipses however I'm unsure for the whole plant with the stems so small.

OKies, I'm gone again.

edited at 6:42 AM, Aug 16th 2022
5:44 PM, Wednesday August 17th 2022

Unfortunately I think when it comes to the branches, you fell into the trap of overthinking and min-maxing that I address in this video from Lesson 0 (which you should certainly review, as it also touches on the importance of keeping your messages brief and avoiding going into unnecessary information which only makes responding more time consuming on my end). That is, you appear to have gotten so into finding the solution to the problem that you looked right past the information that was provided to you in my past critique.

In my last feedback, I mentioned:

Each one starts from one ellipse, continues past the second and stops halfway to the third. The next then starts at the second ellipse, repeating the pattern.

This is also demonstrated in this diagram from the instructions which I linked you to along with the statement above.

Looking at your work, there are definitely places where you're doing it correctly, to varying degrees, but these tend to be scattered amongst instances of you not extending fully halfway to the next ellipse (like here - of course this is one example of many, just to illustrate the point), and instances of you not starting your next segment at the previous ellipse, but rather doing so further ahead as shown here.

Furthermore, it seems you very much misunderstood the point that I raised about your ellipses' widths/degrees. In your response, you stated:

I'm also having trouble getting all the eclipses the same width.

What I stated was that your ellipses should not be maintaining the same width, but rather they should get wider as we slide further away from the viewer. This is demonstrated with props in the Lesson 1 ellipses video I linked you to in the previous feedback - your misunderstanding here makes me question whether you took the time to go back and review it.

While I understand you have other questions amidst your response, I'm going to ask you to do one more page of branches. When you submit it, you can feel free to list your questions there - preferably without additional commentary, so I can identify them easily and answer them quickly.

Next Steps:

Another page of branches.

When finished, reply to this critique with your revisions.
8:13 PM, Wednesday August 17th 2022

https://imgur.com/a/wEmCnG7

Sorry, I have a tendency to "ramble". I'm trying hard not to, alas 30 odd years of habit is a hard thing to "fix".

More branches, check. Don't over think.

I think you misunderstood my question re width of the eclipses. I mean from each edge, not how they get bigger and smaller as we look at it from a fixed point. I'm not technically minded, and it's been years since I was in school but I'll try to explain. Say I'm doing a trunk/pole/pipe that's a consistent 5cm in width, completely ignoring 3d. We have the center line, so that's 2.5cm from each edge to center line. How do I keep each eclipse 5cm without using a ruler? It's something I think will come with practice.

The other question 2 questions I had.

1. Small stems. Like strawberry stems, or vines on a passionfruit. Do we do the same branch exercise for them even if only a few mm wide?

2. Leaves on a plant like the strawberry - do we do them all like the hibiscus, or do we do leaf separately? Some I can see drawing using the hibiscus method, while others would be separate.

Thank you.

8:58 PM, Wednesday August 17th 2022

You're handling the edges much better this time around - although you're still not shifting the degree of your ellipses at all, which contributes to a certain subtle sense of stiffness.

I see that I misunderstood that question - though it's unfortunately that you didn't address that issue all the same. I generally do get concerned when students come back with revisions very quickly, and miss points that have been called out. As to your actual question though, yes - that's something that'll improve with practice, although you're doing a pretty decent job all the same in maintaining a consistent width to the branches, so that's not something I'm worried about. Try to keep your focus on the points I raise in the feedback.

As to your other questions:

  1. Yup, use the branches technique for that - although try to give your constructions lots of space on the page, to mitigate that scale issue. As you get more comfortable constructing things at a larger scale, you'll be able to bring that scale down a bit more and find that it's easier to tackle. Sometimes though, working bigger may require you to focus on a specific chunk of a given reference (like a specific cluster of strawberries) - which is fine, you by no means have to draw everything present there.

  2. The lessons give you tools, but ultimately you judge what is best for a given situation, as there's no specific formula. The approach shown with the hibiscus allows us to lay out structure to keep petals extending to a roughly consistent distance from that center point - but that isn't always what you want. You might have leaves that extend to entirely arbitrary distances (in which case no ellipse would be used), or cases where leaves/petals are arranged in tiers, some ending at a closer radius, others at a farther radius (in which case multiple ellipses can be used). Focusing on the things you learn here as tools in your toolbelt, to be pulled out to adhere to that core principle of building up in stages, will help you approach your needs with more flexibility, finding the solution that suits the case best.

Now, while I am still concerned about your ellipses' degrees remaining consistent, I'll leave that to you to address yourself - although if you're unsure of what I mean, feel free to ask.

I'll go ahead and mark this lesson as complete.

Next Steps:

Move onto lesson 4.

This critique marks this lesson as complete.
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